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Zyne
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Problems with Disgaea 2
Well Disgaea 2 has been out for a while and I hear all these good things about it but I never hear anything about the bad things. I mean this is not a flawless game, it certainly has problems that need to be known.
First of all the lies from the start. Yes this game does lie to you on the cover. It tells that "When Adell and his family accidentally kidnaps the princess of the netherworld, all [hell breaks loose]." If hell broke loose like this game, than hell is nothing more than a bunch of bogus media hype. This was not chaotic what so ever. In fact it was subtle, no one wanting the news to get out. No one knowing she was gone. Hell is quite quiet.
Second is the games characters. Rozalin quickly becomes a cliched character. Although a good character she could not escape her terrible fate of being known for only being Adell's "The Love Interest".
Adell is like any other main character. He plays the role of the normal hero type character. Saying nice stuff and jumping in to protect the girl from beams, fireballs, or any other projectile type attack. He show signs of this early in the game but then it becomes full blown at the end.
Taro and Hanako are two characters I personally despise. Above all other characters I don't like them. They had no role in this game. Unless you want to call being there a role. They should've just stood in front of the pot where they had some purpose. I hate Taro to death. I hate him more than Hanako. I can't stand him. This kid is a crybaby but somehow ends up fighting Demon Lords and Overlords. The worse part of all he is powerful. He drinks milk for the most part and then decides to get one really powerful attack. What sense does that make? Not only that, he is scared of Hanako. Okay I know that there's a psychological thing going on but I don't want to hear it. There's no reason to be afraid of a little girl if you're fighting things like Baciels.
Tink I love him but he should not be a fighting character. He surrenders early and wants to hide. He shouldn't fight.
Yukimaru is fine until she starts actually saying zam after every sentence because then she'll say it 3 and 4 times. It was real cute the but only the very first time you see her.
Etna to be frank she should not have been there at all.
The plot of this game reminded me of opening up my 3 dollar bag of UTZ potatoe chips. It looked like a very big bag and then when you open it, the chips start half way at the bottom. The plot was full of air. It just tries to mindlessly get you from point to the next. Zenon was a b****. He was a villian sooo bad that just making an ordianry fighter the villian would've been better. Etna was a terrible character. I don't mean in a evil type of way neither. I mean in a horrible character type of way. She was like a bee in a hive. Once it decides to leave the hive and never come back, it dies. In the original Disgaea Etna beat on prinnies for being lazy and incompetent. Now she just brutally assaults them for being there. She was just a chracter tacked on after the story was done.
The gameplay is nothing but Geopanels! Everywhere you look its geo panel here and geopanel there. In fact Geo panels took over what use to be called details. For example, instead of actually making a hole in the ground, they'll use a geopanel instead. There's no where in this game I can escape geo symbols and panels. It started to make me react violently.
There were no new weapons. They went through making Makai Kingdom and the the least they could've done was make one new weapon for this game. That was a let down. Not only that but every weapon had 2 new attacks. Why aren't all the moves new? Oh wait I forgot, that's too much to ask for. Some characters have speacial attacks.
Why don't everyone have special attacks? Now some characters look plain and bland. Dark worlds are damn near impoosible to open. Okay, you'll get easy ones like kill a certain enemy but then you get things like stack 10 people up. If you don't have a strategy guide how the hell are you supposed to know that!? Not only that but the dark sun is too easy to destroy. Part of the reason why is because it is unreasonable. Example "Game Over". The special bosses aren't really speacial at all. Characters like Demon Prier, Mid-Boss and mystical old witch woman were just fluff. Nothing but pure sweet fluff. I believe that this game wants to consume everyones time but does not care how it is done.
The music to the game was pretty good but to put it simple there were not enough tunes. So what ended up happening was that it would keep playing the same 2 songs over and over again. This and the shoddy level designs made me give up on the plot in the end. My brother came to complete the game because I was done.
Graphics and design. I believe that someone was slacking off. The chapter before you get to Zenon's castle was nothing but transparent blocks floating in the middle of nowhere. Some moron thought this would be a cool idea. I admit some stages were very well put together (most involve prinnies). To be honest the character models scared me. That's because I quickly found no character has a left side but that my fault because I got too use to things like that. The item world stages are annoying. How can you have walls that go from 0dm to 85dm. Then it will surround the base panel. They Should've drew the line somewhere.
There were some good points though. The texting was very well done. The dark court was entertaining. The pirates were very funny and added some mystery to the item world. The senators were better done this time around. The new innocent town made weaker weapons worth something for once. The cell phones were a very good idea. Calling Kurtis, Axel and the Prism rangers was funny. The secret stuff was more fun and exciting than the boring and dull story line.
Overall I would deem this game as average. It is nothing more than Disgaea with a fresh coating of paint. I think NIS knew these problems and schmoozed us with gifts This game is the perfect way waste 100 to 200 hours of your life.
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10/9/2006, 7:33 pm
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Terru
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
Eh, just browsing casually and picking one thing that I disagree about: the geopanels. Geopanels are the few elements in the game that actually keep the levels fresh and unique. You can only have so many level varieties by plotting different casters and melee classes on a terrain at various levels. Geopanels are the one thing that might require you to look at a map before just steamrolling the enemies with high stats. While they were used a fair ammount in the original Disgaea I felt that they really began getting more creative with them in 2. They were all used in clever ways to add puzzle elements (most of the prinny levels) and even time limits (by using the new moving geo panels). This is especially apparent in the Dark World when the panel set ups become more malicious.
Regardless, we're just sharing opinions. Sorry to hear that you didn't enjoy it quite as much.
Last edited by Terru, 10/10/2006, 1:29 pm
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10/10/2006, 1:29 pm
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Zyne
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
To be honest I completely agree with you. The geopanels were used more cleverly than the first one but still sometimes it made the enemies pretty stupid. The enemy would stand there with or without the geopanel present. This hurt the enemy outlaws the most. For the most part I can't really say I hated the puzzle elements. Some were pretty fun, with the exception of the road to Zenon's castle.
I do enjoy the game to some extent. Well ever since I stopped palying the story mode. It's not like I said this was a bad game. It was just one that needed a little more work.
You are right though. This is just our opinions.
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10/10/2006, 8:39 pm
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GibbBoy
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
Reading through your post, most of the points you gave can be fixed by simply switching the spoken dialog to Japanese. In Japanese the game is awesome. I'm not sure if it's better than Disgaea 1 (certainly not storywise) but it's damn near close to being my favorite game of all time.
In English, Adell sounds like a whiny version of Dean Cain (Superman from Lois and Clark). In Japanese his voice is completely different. It's very deep, more genuine sounding.
Yukimaru's way of speaking in Japanese is what triggered the "Zam" thing in English. NISA was faced with a very unusual manerism of speech from the Japanese language track, and I think they handled it relatively well. Yukimaru ends alot of her sentences in Japanese with a phrase that's kind of like:
ございむっよ OR ございむって
gozaimmyo or gozaimmte (not official romanji). It also helps to know that the phrase "gozaimasu" in Japanese is a way of making something very formal, or very polite. Basically Yukimaru's character is supposed to be absurdedly polite, but she's also got kind of a weird speech manerism which makes it sound weird.
In Japanese the way Yukimaru speaks is awesome. I was laughing pretty hard through that whole story part. I actually havent heard her English voice, but I'm assuming she just says "Zam" because that's what my friend said who's playing the game dubbed.
As for Tink being a playable character, you must have had a pretty hard time in the Item World if you didnt have Tink as your quick stage skipper. Put 3 high movement shoes on him and he flies straight to the stage skip point. Very useful for items you dont care about leveling up that you need to get specialists out of.
I will agree with you on a couple points tho. It would have been nice to have a couple of new weapon types. It seems the only new weapon type was the Monster-Int type. I dont really use monsters so it doesnt matter to me too much.
Also, the plot/story was decent, not spectacular. I thought the Disgaea 1 storyline was fantastic, one of the best I've seen in an RPG. It had tons of comedy and fun stuff, while still managing to sneak a rather deep and moving plot.
Like Terru said, I love the geopanels. They make the game fresh and interesting.
As far as your points about graphics, I think you're nitpicking. To this day I have never seen a sprite based game that draws a different sprite for whether they're facing right or left. 2D fighters and all other sprite based games just flip the sprites. Right handed characters instantly become left handed, that's just the way sprite games are. If you ever make a sprite based game and make twice as many sprite drawings for each character as any other game, then I will give you some props.
My recommendation to you would be to try starting the game over and playing it with Japanese voice acting turned on. The characters personalities fit much better, and some of the dialog makes more sense as well. Tho I suppose if you're anti-Japanese language, than this wont help you much, but I would hope anybody who's playing a sprite based tactics RPG from Japan would welcome the chance to play the game in it's original form (only with translated text).
Last edited by GibbBoy, 10/11/2006, 7:52 am
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10/11/2006, 7:44 am
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Zyne
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
The Tink thing, I think you misunderstood. I said he shouldn't be a character because he's a coward. Its more of his personality than his abilities.
Although I don't use Tink, I compensated well. I use a ninja with an accelerator and some angel sandals. So I get by very well, thank you for asking.
Well I had no problems with the voice acting in general.
The problems I had with Adell were much different.
The sprite problem is something I had after playing Phantom Brave and Makai Kingdom. You see in those games they had left sides. So when I played Disgaea 2 I guess I was expecting the same thing. Then reality happened.
If the story does make sense in Japanese how will I know this if I'm still reading English text. Does the text change as well? The storyline did bother me but knowing I'm playing those stages with sorry rewards. I really would like to pass on the story but now I'm curious.
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10/11/2006, 8:20 pm
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GibbBoy
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
I still dont understand this "no left sides" thing. Makai Kindom and Phantom Brave had a different battle system that was more free roaming. Disgaea 2 is grid based so the characters can only face 1 of 4 different directions. Having side views of the sprites would be pointless.
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10/12/2006, 8:28 am
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Zyne
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
It means exactly as stated. I got scared. that's all.
Last edited by Zyne, 10/14/2006, 9:49 pm
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10/14/2006, 5:52 pm
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Gorenza
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
Holy cow wow I strolled in late.
Well hello guys.
As far as you picking on playable character we might want to consider Disgaea for a sec.
Every character isn't exactly up to a heroic standard. Come on Hogmeister, Wednesday and Gordon? It seems to me that Disgaea universe follow the old Stan Lee adage anyone can be a hero. I really don't see anything wrong with that. It's your choice how much attention you pay on each character. You have a lot of anime fall backs to consider. Every hero has a story to tell and every hero has a side kick. It would how ever be interesting if the story line changed if you focused more on leveling your side kick rather than you hero.
As far as Etna entering the fray. I think of it this way. Most Disgaea fans would agree that making a sequel and not using any of the original characters is pretty darn lame. Etna was a seriously sweet side kick. Placing her evenly in the game gave us all hope that we would see a return of the true hero of Disgaea. Which he was delivered as a playable character.
Part of the charm of Disgaea is having many playable character at your disposal. This kind of game style isn't exactly a new concept. We can take a look at Final fantasy series if need be. Being able to pick and choose what you parties dynamic is a good thing.
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6/13/2008, 11:30 am
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Tiredman
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
You are late, thats a fact, will be surprised if anybody who posted in this thread see it again =p
The disgaea characters were 1 dimensional, but highly enjoyable, extremely well english voice acted, and had much more enjoyable monsters, and play mechanics. I laughed every single chapter except the moon one, and that one just plain owned storywise and added an interesting example of how drama can be added to a comedy in a beautiful way.
As for disgaea 2, the game just wasn't as much fun as disgaea. The levels weren't as engaging, due to that issue with some enemies just standing there, as was mentioned earlier. I found half of the geo panel fights boring, and annoyingly long, where as in disgaea, I loved the concept. It got to the point where to this day I still haven't beaten disgaea 2, or even touched the dark world version of area's because I couldnt stomach the main story. The characters were nowhere near as interesting as disgaea 1, the storyline did not compare, and the over all bonus material just did not really draw me in as much as disgaea 1.
I think disgaea 2 tried to make things more complicated than they needed to be. Disgaea 1 is one of my favorite games, if not the favorite, while disgaea 2 doesnt crack my top 20.
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6/18/2008, 12:54 pm
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greyshadow
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Re: Problems with Disgaea 2
wow tiredman our opinions is flipped on your like of disgaea 2, i find disgaea 1 less fun than 2 and the gameplay is better too.
disgaea 1 had a much better story but most the monsters wasnt good to me or just useless, another thing was item world was a total drag in 1 as well, although 2 had its flaws and what not it was still a solid game, adell was meant to be a a stereotype hero which made the game funny because adell was badass for no reason,like that guy, taro is awesome no matter who says he's not, he drinks milk like gatorade and comes back with force and proves that just because your a whiny little brat doesn't mean you dont have force on you, screw hanako i hate her she should be tied up and tortured, next up i like yukimaru she is cute and the zam thing is priceless and catchy i never got annoyed by the zam thing either, etna was useful in the plot in fact it made the game a bit more chaotic i mean come on a crazy pink haired sex demon stroll around throwing death blast and abusing prinnies for kicks, and she had a reason to assualt prinnies...they failed at their jobs..
another thing i like the geo panel thing sometimes, next up on the lines, the story wasnt that bad afterall disgaea is just a bunch of misadventures if you ever notice.
another thing is disgaea isnt makai kingdom so no new weapons is needed for this game, although i do like the new skills they added.
well thats all im biting out for now...
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8/6/2008, 5:51 am
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